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5
THEREUPON,
TOM FONTAINE
being by me first duly sworn to tell the whole truth,
as hereinafter certified, testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. NASH:
Q. Mr. Fontaine, I'm Beverly Nash. I'm
counsel for the United States in this litigation.
We're here to try and find out what
computer systems the Water Management District
has, how they operate, and how they're used, and
the data on it, how that data is formatted.
You're here as a representative of the Water
Management District having knowledge on one or
more of the 9 categories in which we're interested
in getting information.
Have you been shown that list of
categories?
A. Yes, I have.
Q. And to which categories are you
knowledgeable?
A. No. 8, would be my best.
Q. What is your title or position?
6
A. It's director of water quality division,
department of research and evaluation.
Q. And what are your responsibilities as
director of water quality division?
A. I oversee the collection of water quality
data and its analysis.
Q. And how long have you been the director?
A. For approximately six months.
Q. Have you had other positions at the Water
Management District?
A. No.
Q. What is your educational background?
A. Going in reverse: I got a Ph.D. in
environmental engineering sciences, that was in
1978. You can tell me how far you want to go back,
if you can.
Masters of Science, environmental
engineering sciences, 1974. Bachelors in Biology,
1972.
Q. What was your position prior to being
director of the water quality division at the
Water Management District?
A. I was at the Great Lakes Environmental
Research Lab in Ann Arbor, Michigan, that's the
NOAAL, National Oceanic and Atmospheric
7
Administration Laboratory.
Q. To whom do you report in the department of
research and evaluation?
A. To two people. Pete Rose and Leslie
Wedderburn.
Q. And what is Pete Rose's position?
A. He is the director of the department of
research and evaluation.
Q. And Leslie Wedderburn's position as well?
A. She's the deputy director of the same
department.
Q. And how many employees work for you in the
water quality division?
A. Twenty-eight.
Q. Can they be categorized in to types of
positions?
A. Yes.
Q. And what would those types be?
A. They range from technicians to senior
professionals with varying degrees in between.
Q. What computers are utilized by the water
quality division?
A. This is all employees?
Q. Yes.
A. There are a number of IBM PS/2s. There are
8
some SUN work stations. I have a Macintosh.
Q. What work is done on the IBM PS/2?
A. As far as I know, it's mostly word
processing. There is, I'm sure, some statistical
analysis. Without elaborating too much, you know,
I think it's fair to say I don't know all of the
details of all the computer work, having been here
only six months.
Q. I understand that. Do you what software
packages are utilized on the IBM PS/2s?
A. Word Perfect for word processing. For
statistical analysis, I believe SAS is either on
the IBMs or it accesses one of the other computers,
but it may be run from the IBM.
Q. And what is the nature of the work done on
the SUN work stations?
A. I believe it's statistical analysis.
Q. And what is the data base on which the
statistical analysis is done?
A. This would be the water quality data base
that resides on something called, a LIMS, L-I-M-S,
system.
Q. In which computers is the LIMS system?
A. The LIMS system, as I understand it, is
something in the chemistry, water chemistry
9
division, and I believe it's on physically a Perkin
Elmer.
Q. Do you yourself do any work on the SUN
work station?
A. No.
Q. Do you do any work with the water quality
data base?
A. Not directly, no.
Q. You indicated that you personally use a
Macintosh?
A. I have a Macintosh, yes.
Q. What work do you do on the Macintosh?
A. Primarily, I have a management information
system for my division which allows me to keep
track of schedules, projects, priorities.
Q. Do you have a list of all the projects
that the water quality division is working on?
A. Do I have a list of them?
Q. Yes.
A. Yes.
MS. STOLLMAN: Are you referring to
projects that are on the computer system?
MS. NASH: Yes.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where is that list
maintained?
10
A. I don't have a physical paper list of
anything on the computer systems. Maybe you can
explain a little more exactly what you're looking
for.
Q. Is there a list on any computer of the
projects that the division is doing?
A. Yes.
Q. Does that list have a name?
A. It has a computer name, so if you will --
Q. What is that name?
A. Well, there is more than one project, so
let me give you an example. It would be something
to the effect of "Project, and then a period, and
then 707."
Q. Is there a description anywhere of what
the various projects that are named that way are,
for example, list of what project 707 is and any
other projects that you similarly have listed?
A. There are documents put out every year by
the department of research and evaluation that
describe what goes on in those projects.
Q. And is that list broken down by projects
that the water quality division are doing?
A. Uh-huh, yes.
Q. You indicated that you oversee the
11
collection of water quality data. What is the
source of that data?
A. Can you define what you mean by, "the
source"?
Q. Where does the data come from that's being
collected?
A. Well, it comes from sampling of water.
Q. Where are these water samples taken?
A. At various locations in the district.
Q. Is there a record or list of the water
sampling locations?
MS. STOLLMAN: I don't believe you've
established that the samples are taken using any
sort of a computer system.
Are your questions limited to samples
collected by the computer?
MS. NASH: I'm looking at where the
data is that is put into the computer, and that's
what I'm trying to find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: What is your question?
MS. NASH: Can you read back the
question?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
12
MS. STOLLMAN: You may answer it, if
you know.
A. Yes.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where is that record?
A. In various places.
Q. Does the record have a name?
A. No, not that I know of.
Q. What are the various places where the
record is maintained?
A. Well, they're on, you know, paper, and
they're in files.
Q. If you wanted to know where all the
sampling sites were, where would you go to find
them?
A. You're speaking of a file again, not the
physical location. You could get them from my
file. There is an older publication that's called
something to the effect of, "Water Quality Sampling
Network for the South Florida Water Management
District," which was published approximately a year
ago.
Q. Is the information in that publication
still current?
A. No.
13
Q. Is there a record of which sampling sites
have changed?
A. Yes.
Q. Where is that record?
A. I would have that information or it is
accessible at the district -- let's put it that
way.
Q. If someone from outside the Water
Management District asked for that record, who
would they ask?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, I would object
to these questions. The witness has testified
that he is responsive to Area No. 8, which is: "The
locations (where prepared and where maintained) of
all water budgets and nutrient budgets for the EAA,
Water Conservation Areas, Loxahatchee National
Wildlife Refuge, and Everglades National Park."
To the extent that your questions are
directed at identifying the locations of where
those budgets are prepared and where they are
maintained, I will permit him to answer; but these
detailed questions on to other areas that are
related to the water budgets, but not related to
the locations, are inappropriate at this
deposition, and I would instruct him not to
14
answer.
MS. NASH: They are directly related
to the locations. The locations are where the data
is collected, and that's all I'm trying to figure
out is how to find out the list of where the data
is collected.
MS. STOLLMAN: The locations, as I
interpret it in this notice, are the locations on
the computer of where they're prepared and where
they are maintained.
You may ask questions with respect to what
computer systems these water budgets are prepared
on, and which computer systems these water budgets
are maintained on.
We're not here to discuss detailed
information about the water budgets and their
specific content other than to the extent it is
necessary to identify which computer files you are
interested in.
MS. NASH: Well, the only way to find
out which computer files we're interested in is to
find out what the data is that's going into the
computer files, and that's all I'm trying to find
out.
MS. STOLLMAN: I will permit him to
15
answer questions directed towards general
information which would be required to identify
what computer files they're interested in.
A. Let me --
MS. STOLLMAN: Is there a question
pending?
MS. NASH: Yes, there is.
THE WITNESS: Can I hear it again?
I'm sorry. We lost track of things.
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: What record are you
referring to?
MS. NASH: The record of the changes
from the publication on the water quality sampling
network that he mentioned.
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, I don't see
that that's relevant to identify what water budget
you want to request, where it's prepared, where
it's maintained.
MS. NASH: Well, I don't know that
until I know --
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, we are not on a
16
fishing expedition here. I have given you some
leeway to ask questions that are leading to: How
would I identify what samples are taken and getting
information that you can -- identifying where you
could find that information, but we are not here to
discuss --
MS. NASH: Well, we're not going to
know whether we're interested in the data until we
know where it comes from, and that's what I'm
trying to find out is, just what the list is of
where the data is collected, so we know whether we
are interested in it or not.
MS. STOLLMAN: Your question is: Where
is the list of what data is collected?
MS. NASH: That's correct, or the
data sites. It's not a difficult question.
MS. STOLLMAN: You may answer.
A. Okay. The information on station
location, as it exists now, I can supply you with.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Are you --
THE WITNESS: Can I point something
out?
MS. STOLLMAN: Did you want to ask me
a question?
THE WITNESS: It's just a point of
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clarification on No. 8.
MS. STOLLMAN: If there is no
question pending, I don't want you to answer a
question.
THE WITNESS: Okay.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Did I just hear you say,
Mr. Fontaine, that you know nothing about water
budgets?
A. It's not my field.
Q. Do you know anything about nutrient
budgets?
A. The nutrient aspect is the part of Item 8
that I'm most familiar with.
Q. Can you describe the nutrient budgets that
have been done on the Everglades Agricultural
Area?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, I would
instruct you to answer this question to the extent
that it's necessary to identify what the different
nutrient budgets are in the computer system.
A. In the computer system, there is no
nutrient budget, okay?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Is data obtained from data
bases on computers to do the nutrient budgets?
A. Yes.
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Q. What data is utilized to do -- well, let
me back-up.
Is there a nutrient budget that's been
done -- budget or budgets that's been done on the
EAA?
A. I know of one.
Q. And when was that done?
A. This year. Exact date, I'm not sure.
Q. Who did the nutrient budget on the EAA?
A. My staff in cooperation with other
district staff.
Q. From what other divisions or departments?
A. The same department, research and
evaluation, water resources division.
Q. What were the data files that were
utilized to do the nutrient budget?
A. Specific names of files?
Q. Yes, sir.
A. I have no idea.
Q. Who would know?
A. My staff.
Q. Who on your staff?
A. Dave Soballe.
Q. Anyone else?
A. Possibly Brad Jones.
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Q. Are you aware of any nutrient budgets done
on any of the Water Conservation Areas?
A. No.
Q. Are you aware of any nutrient budgets done
on Loxahatchee National Wildlife Refuge?
A. No.
Q. Are you aware of any nutrient budgets done
on the Everglades National Park?
A. No.
Q. Where are the results of the nutrient
budget on the EAA?
MS. STOLLMAN: This is, where are
they stored? Are you asking him where are they
stored or on what computer system?
MS. NASH: I am asking him: Where
are the results of the nutrient budget; and that is
my question.
MS. STOLLMAN: You may answer if you
know.
A. They definitely are on hard copy paper.
In terms of computer files, I don't know the name.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Who would know?
A. Excuse me, while I think this one through,
because it's going to be on one computer system.
My best guess is, it should be on my secretary's
20
computer.
Q. And what is your secretary's name?
A. Sandy Joseph.
Q. And what computer would she have this on?
A. It's a Xerox number -- I don't know.
Q. Who did the nutrient budget analysis on
the EAA?
A. It was Dave Soballe and Brad Jones.
Q. Are you aware of any water quality
analyses that have been done within the Water
Conservation Areas?
A. Within the actual borders?
Q. Of the Water Conservation Areas, yes.
MS. STOLLMAN: And again, limited to
done on the computer.
A. I don't know.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Are you aware of any water
quality analyses of water going into the Water
Conservation Areas?
A. Yes.
Q. Who has done those analyses?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, these would be
analyses performed on the computer systems.
A. Analyses is different from inputting to a
data table. I'm trying to get a sense of your --
21
what you're looking for.
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you clarify your
question, please?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) I'm looking for whether
there have been analyses of any of the water
quality data --
A. Uh-huh.
Q. -- of water?
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer if you
understand the term "analyses."
A. Well, yeah, I mean statistical analyses of
data is different from simply collecting data.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) That's correct.
A. So are we talking about amassing data in a
file or are we talking about analyzing the data in
the file?
Q. I am talking about analyzing the data
that's in the file.
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you repeat the
question, please?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
A. I'm not sure I know who's done them.
22
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Who would know?
A. Who would know? I think -- I think Pete
Rose or Leslie Wedderburn, W-e-d-d-e-r-b-u-r-n.
Q. Do you know what data bases were utilized
to do the water quality analyses of the water going
into the Water Conservation Areas?
A. That would most certainly be either the
LIMS that I have referred to earlier or something
called the Britton-Lee, B-r-i-t-t-o-n dash L-e-e.
Q. Do you know whether water quality data
exists on any computers other than the LIMS or the
Britton-Lee?
A. Yes.
Q. What are the computers?
A. I believe it's an IBM something or other.
Q. And where is this IBM computer that
contains --
A. It's over in -- you know, the main B50
Building.
Q. Do you know who inputs the other water
quality data that would be on this IBM?
A. It would be Dave Soballe.
Q. Is there a difference between the water
quality data on the IBM and that on the LIMS?
A. When you say "difference," you're assuming
23
they're both on the same -- I mean, both data sets
are on the same place, right?
MS. STOLLMAN: You can ask her for
clarification, if you don't understand the
question.
THE WITNESS: That's what I'm trying
to get a feeling for.
A. For there to be a difference, they have to
be on the same disk, that has to be on both
computers so --
Q. (By Ms. Nash) But what I'm trying to find
out is, if the data in the data set that's on the
IBM --
A. Uh-huh.
Q. -- is different than the data that's on
the data set in the LIMS?
A. I would characterize it as in addition to
the data on the IBMs, and it's in addition to
what's on the LIMS.
Q. What is the source of the water quality
data on the IBM?
A. This is data from Lake Okeechobee
sampling.
Q. Do I understand then that the water
quality data on the LIMS does not contain Lake
24
Okeechobee samples?
A. It will contain some, but not all.
Q. Are there any other differences in the data
bases?
A. I don't really have the experience with
these data bases yet to answer that question.
Q. Who would know?
A. I'm not sure who to direct you to on that
one.
Q. Are you aware of water quality analyses of
water coming out of the Water Conservation Areas?
A. Yes.
Q. Who has done the water quality analyses of
water coming out of the Water Conservation Areas?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, this would be
water quality analyses on the computer.
A. Okay. I had trouble with this question
last time. Analyses? Those data are on the LIMS
system --
Q. (By Ms. Nash) And as I understand --
A. -- and can be accessed by people
interested in accessing that data.
Q. Are you aware of people that have analyzed
that data?
A. Again, in my short tenure here, I don't
25
have any knowledge of people, during this six
months, that have analyzed that data.
Q. Are you aware of any analyses of the
relationship of nutrients from the agricultural
areas to structure discharges in the Water
Conservation Areas?
A. I'm sorry.
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you repeat that
question?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: You can ask for
clarification, if you don't understand the
question.
A. Sure. Why don't you go ahead and clarify
that, if you could, or give me a little more time
to search my memory banks.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Why don't you take your
time to think about it.
A. The relationship between nutrients and
discharge into the Water Conservation Areas?
Q. Yes.
A. From the agricultural areas?
26
Q. Yes.
A. There are measurements of water quality
concentrations in those discharges, yes.
Q. Who has done these analyses?
A. Okay. The person -- again, I'm having
trouble with the word, "analyses."
Let me just briefly say that there is a
lot of data collected that has not, in my time,
been analyzed in a way that I would call analyzing
things.
There is a person who collects it, who
supervises the collection of it, Larry Grosser,
that's entered into the data base. In terms of
doing anything with that, analytically speaking,
I'm not aware.
Q. In what division is Mr. Grosser employed?
A. He works for me. He's in the water
quality division. He's a technician supervisor,
and is not, for the record, responsible for
analyses of any data.
Q. Are you aware of any documentation of
water quality standard violations?
MS. STOLLMAN: I would object to that
question and instruct the witness not to answer. I
don't believe that's relevant to the locations
27
where prepared and where maintained of all water
budgets and nutrients budgets for the areas listed
here.
MS. NASH: I'm entitled to know what
information the water quality division has on its
computers, and that's what I'm trying to find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: I believe your
question goes well beyond that, and you can repeat
it for me.
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: I don't understand
your question. Could you clarify that for me,
please?
MS. NASH: Ask the witness if he
understands the question.
A. It's a very general question. Are you
looking at some specific --
MS. STOLLMAN: I would instruct the
witness not to answer unless you can
clarify the question, because it seems to be asking
different things. If you want to know what
policies or guidelines there are with respect to
28
water budgets and other work done on those systems,
that is one question. The end of your question
seems to go into another area. If you could break
that down for the witness, I would permit him to
answer.
MS. NASH: He is the director of the
water quality division, and I am entitled to find
out whether the water quality division or anyone
else he's aware of has any documentation on
computer, if it makes you happy, of water quality
standard violations, and that is what I am
inquiring into.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, I don't believe
that's relevant to this area.
MS. NASH: It is relevant to --
MS. STOLLMAN: You are entitled to
ask about what he has on the computer systems and
--
MS. NASH: That's what I'm trying to
find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: -- what each division
has on the computer systems, and if there are
computer guidelines with respect to the water
budgets and nutrients budgets. With respect to
water quality violations, that may -- I mean, if
29
that's something that he has listed on his computer
system --
MS. NASH: And I'm entitled to find
out, and that is what the question is.
MS. STOLLMAN: Okay. If there are
computer files which contain information on water
quality violations, then, you're entitled to ask
him if there are such files and where they are
located. And you can answer the question.
A. That's a good enough question?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Yes. If you can answer the
question.
A. Fine. As far as I know, there is no data
sets out there that specifically say there are
water quality violations in place A, B, or C.
Q. Are you aware of any Water Management
District guidelines for assessing water quality
violations?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, I would object
to this. "Assessing water quality violations," are
not the subject of this deposition.
MS. NASH: If the information is on
computer, it most certainly is.
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer to the
extent there may be guidelines on a computer
30
system.
A. The answer is no.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) The guidelines for
utilizing the computer for doing water quality
violation assessments?
MS. STOLLMAN: What is your question.
MS. NASH: That is my question.
A. I kind of lost the sense of the question.
Can we go back and do that one again?
MS. NASH: Read back the question.
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: Are you asking whether
there are guidelines?
MS. NASH: Yes. For utilizing the
computer to do water quality violation assessments.
MS. STOLLMAN: To the extent they may
exist on the computer, you may answer.
A. If I understood your question correctly,
there are no guidelines on the computer.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) My question was, whether
there are guidelines which require the utilization
of the computer to do water quality violation
31
assessments?
A. I don't know.
Q. Who would know?
A. I'm not sure.
Q. Are you aware of any GIS files that show
the distribution of nutrients in the areas covered
by the Water Management District?
A. No.
Q. Are you aware of any CADD files which show
the distribution of nutrients in the areas covered
by the Water Management District?
A. "The distribution of nutrients"? Can you
clarify that one?
Q. The location in water samples of
nutrients.
MS. STOLLMAN: Were you asking for
CADD files?
MS. NASH: Yes.
THE WITNESS: Uh-huh.
A. Yes.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where are those files
located?
A. I don't know what machine it's located on.
Q. Do you know who has responsibility for
those files?
32
A. I think the best way of answering this
question --
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer the
question if you know. I don't want you to
speculate if you don't know.
THE WITNESS: Oh, okay. Sorry.
A. I believe that Dera Muzyk would have the
CADD files.
Q. Are you aware of any CADD files that show
the water quality in the areas covered by the Water
Management District?
A. I'm sorry. That sounds like the very same
question.
Q. The prior question related to nutrient
conservations. This is asking for water quality in
general?
A. Yes.
Q. And where are those files?
A. Excuse me. Are these CADD files again?
Q. Yes.
A. I would try Dera Muzyk again.
Q. Is she employed in the water quality
division?
A. Uh-huh, yes.
Q. What is her title?
33
A. Her title is GIS CADD technician.
I should --
MS. STOLLMAN: If there is no
question pending, I don't want you to testify.
THE WITNESS: Okay. Can I have a
second with you?
MS. STOLLMAN: Do you want to ask me
a question?
THE WITNESS: Sure.
(WHEREUPON, there was a discussion
held off the record.)
MS. STOLLMAN: I think the witness
had something to add to your question about the
location of CADD files.
A. Yeah, right. There is one other location
where there is some CADD files that have nutrient
concentrations.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) And where is that?
A. That is up in our Okeechobee Field Station
Water Quality Office.
Q. On the CADD files that you indicated Dera
Muzyk would be most knowledgeable on, do you know
what locations the water quality data is from?
34
A. Lake Okeechobee very definitely, and other
locations I'm not sure.
Q. Do you know whether there is any data in
those CADD files from the Everglades National Park?
A. I don't believe so.
Q. Do you know whether there's any data from
the Water Conservation Areas?
A. I don't believe so.
Q. Do you know whether there's any data from
the Everglades Agricultural Area?
A. Can I seek some clarification?
MS. STOLLMAN: Would you clarify your
question?
MS. NASH: Do you have a -- what's
the problem?
MS. STOLLMAN: Is there a term that
you don't understand?
THE WITNESS Yeah. I'm having
trouble with some of the terminology.
MS. STOLLMAN: What terms don't you
understand. I can ask her to define them.
THE WITNESS: Oh, geez.
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you repeat the
question?
THE WITNESS: I hate to make you
35
repeat it, but --
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you read it
back?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
A. In CADD files?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Yes.
A. I don't know.
Q. Who would know?
A. My best guess is Dera Muzyk.
Q. Do you know whether the water quality
division is doing any data base development with
the water quality data?
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you explain what
you mean by "data base development"?
MS. NASH: If the witness understands
the questions, he can answer it.
MS. STOLLMAN: Do you understand the
question?
THE WITNESS: To the extent that the
whole district is working on development of Oracle,
a new data base, but I know nothing about Oracle
itself.
36
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Other than the development
of the Oracle data base, is the water quality
division doing any other data base development
with the water quality data?
A. Nothing outside of the existing LIMS and
Britton-Lee that I know of.
Q. You indicated that there was also CADD
files on water quality in the Okeechobee Field
Station Office?
A. Yes.
Q. Who in that office has those CADD files?
A. My best guess is Elaine Rankin,
R-a-n-k-i-n.
Q. Does the water quality division utilize
any GIS files?
A. I don't know of any that they use.
Q. Does the water quality division utilize
any aerial photographs?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, this would be
in the computer system with respect to computer
analyses or data?
THE WITNESS: Not that I know of.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Does the water quality
division utilize any satellite photography or
imagery?
37
A. Not that I know of.
Q. Does the water quality division utilize
any vegetation mapping?
A. Not that I know of.
Q. Does the water quality division do any
trend analysis?
A. Trend analysis?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, this would be
on the computer.
A. Yes.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Can you describe the trend
analyses that are being done?
A. Yes.
MS. STOLLMAN: You may describe them
to the extent that it's necessary to identify the
files contained in the computer.
THE WITNESS: Sure.
A. The trend analysis is on phosphorus volume
weighted, annual average phosphorus concentrations
entering Lake Okeechobee.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Is the water quality
division doing any trend analysis on phosphors for
other locations, such as, the Water Conservation
Areas?
A. I don't know.
38
Q. Who would know?
A. I think the best person to ask would be my
predecessor.
Q. And who was that?
A. That's Tony Federico.
Q. Is the water quality division doing any
trend analyses on water going into the Everglades
National Park?
A. Again, I don't know.
Q. And who would know?
A. I would, again, refer you to Tony
Federico. I'm sorry. Yes, the water quality
division is doing some trend analyses on stuff --
on nutrients entering Everglades National Park.
Q. And who is doing that trend analysis?
A. George Shih.
Q. Do you know the source of the data Mr.
Shih is utilizing to do the trend analysis?
A. I believe he is using data that we collect
and other data from perhaps Everglades National
Park and perhaps the Corps of Engineers.
Q. Is Mr. Shih an employee of the water
quality division?
A. He is on loan to environmental planning
from the water quality division.
39
Q. What is his title?
A. Senior professional.
Q. Are there any reports of the trend
analyses Mr. Shih has been doing on the Everglades
National Park?
MS. STOLLMAN: Are you talking about
reports that are on the computer system?
MS. NASH: Or generated by the
computer system.
MS. STOLLMAN: To the extent that you
know, you may answer. I don't want you to
speculate about Mr. Shih work.
A. I have seen no reports.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Do you know which computer
Mr. Shih utilizes to do those trend analyses?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether Mr. Shih has reached
any interim or preliminary results on trend
analyses in Everglades National Park?
MS. STOLLMAN: I would object to
asking in-depth questions about Mr. Shih's reports.
MS. NASH: If he knows.
MS. STOLLMAN: What is your
question? Could you read it back for me, please?
40
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: I would object to that
question and instruct the witness not to answer.
We are not here to discuss results of analyses.
MS. NASH: We are entitled to know
where the data is, what data exists, how we can
access that data, and if there are preliminary or
interim conclusions that have been reached using
the computer data, we are entitled to know that
they exist and how we can access them.
MS. STOLLMAN: You are not entitled
to know whether or not preliminary conclusions or
results have been reached with respect to analyses
done. We're here to discuss what information
exists and where it is located --
MS. NASH: And that's what I'm trying
to find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: -- not what sort of --
MS. NASH: If these are in data
files, we're entitled to know what files they're
in, what analyses exist in those files, so we can
access that information. That is the whole purpose
of these depositions. That is the very core of
41
these depositions.
This is the first substantive information
that we might actually obtain from these
depositions.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, it's my
interpretation that we --
MS. NASH: Well, fine. He can answer
the question if he knows the answer. If he doesn't,
that's fine.
MS. STOLLMAN: I have instructed him
not to answer the question.
MS. NASH: Well, we'll take that up
with the Court, too.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Is anyone in the water
quality division doing any work on the Everglades
SWIM Plan?
A. It is not our responsibility to do any of
that work, although, we may be consulted.
Q. Is anyone in the water quality division
doing any work on the potential ONRW designation
for Everglades National Park?
MS. STOLLMAN: We haven't established
whether or not the witness is familiar with that
designation.
MS. NASH: If he doesn't understand
42
the question, he can say-so.
A. For my own edification, tell me what the
ONRW stands for.
Q. Outstanding -- I can't remember if it's
national or natural resource water.
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer to the
extent you know whether someone is still working on
it on the computer system. I don't want you to
speculate if you don't know.
A. Well, I won't speculate then, I will just
say no, or I don't know.
MS. NASH: I have no further
questions
MS. STOLLMAN: Would you like to take
a break before we continue?
THE WITNESS: Sure.
(Short break.)
CROSS-EXAMINATION
QUESTION BY MR. RICHARDS:
Q. Mr. Fontaine, my name is Joe Richards. I
represent the cities of Belle Glade and Clewiston.
43
In reference to the nutrient budget on the
EAA, you mentioned there is a hard copy of this
budget. Has this been published by the district?
A. No.
Q. Will it be published?
A. Can you tell me what you mean by
publication?
Q. The district distributes technical
publications, technical memoranda, official
documents.
A. I know of no plans to put out a technical
publication at this time.
Q. Do you know whether this nutrient budget
is available to the public?
A. I don't think that's for me to say,
frankly.
Q. Do you know the time frame covered by this
budget?
MS. STOLLMAN: Which budget are you
referring to?
MR. RICHARDS: The same budget we
have been discussing.
A. Let me think about that for a second.
I believe that it covers approximately
eight years.
44
Q. (By Mr. Richards) And the last year would
be? Do you know?
A. That's what I'm having trouble
remembering. I guess I will just have to say I
can't remember.
Q. Okay. You mentioned that you were aware
of water quality analysis of the water discharged
to the Water Conservation Areas. Do you know the
time frame for this thing?
A. This is an ongoing sampling study that has
-- you know, it was there when I got there. I'm
not sure how many years back it goes.
Q. You also mentioned the input of water
quality data on an IBM computer. Do you know the
ultimate destination of that data?
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you clarify what
you mean by "ultimate destination"?
MR. RICHARDS: Do you understand the
question?
A. I'm a little confused myself.
Q. (By Mr. Richards) Is it retained on this
IBM computer or does it end up in another data base
somewhere?
A. My intent is that all water quality data
will go on to the Oracle data base that the
45
district has or is working on.
Q. Would that be the chemical analysis
archive system?
A. I'm not sure of chemical analysis
system. I don't know that name.
Q. Would it be on the Britton-Lee computer?
A. Okay. Geez, I'm a little confused. Can
we back-up an get that question again?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
A. If I understand your question correctly,
the chemical analysis system that you were
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