|
|||||||
Deposition from United States v. SFWMD, et al., Case No. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER |
|||||||
|
|||||||
|
|||||||
|
|||||||
Deposition from United States v. SFWMD, et al., Case No. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER |
|||||||
|
|||||||
|
|||||||
** 1
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA
CASE NO. 88-1886-CIV-HOEVELER
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, et al., )
)
Plaintiffs, )
)
VS. )
)
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT )
DISTRICT; JOHN R. WODRASKA, )
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, SOUTH FLORIDA )
WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT; )
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL )
REGULATION; AND DALE TWACHTMANN, )
SECRETARY, FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF )
ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION, et. al., )
)
Defendants. )
/
DEPOSITION OF SHARON TROST
TAKEN ON BEHALF OF THE PLAINTIFF
***
DATE: August 27, 1990
PROFESSIONAL REPORTING SERVICE
Commerce Center
324 Datura Street, Suite 303
West Palm Beach, Florida 33401
(407) 659-4046
** 2
INDEX
August 27, 1990 DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS
SHARON TROST
By Ms. Beverly Nash 5
By Mr. Joe Richards 29
** 3
The deposition of Sharon Trost, in the
above-entitled and numbered cause, was taken before
me, KAREN BAUER FRY, C.S.R., Court Reporter and
Notary Public for the State of Florida at Large, at
Professional Reporting Service, Commerce Center,
324 Datura Street, in the City of West Palm Beach,
Palm Beach County, in the State of Florida,
beginning at the hour of 12:10 o'clock p.m., on
August 27, 1990, pursuant to the Notice in said cause
for the taking of said deposition, which is annexed
to the Court file herein, on behalf of the
Plaintiff in the above-entitled action pending in
the above-named court.
The appearances at said time and place were
as follows:
Beverly Sherman Nash, Esquire
U.S. Department of Justice
Environmental and Natural
Resources Division
P. O. Box 663
Washington, D.C. 20044-0663
Attorney for Plaintiff
Joseph Richards, Esquire
Peeples, Earl & Blank, P.A.
Two South Biscayne Blvd.
One Biscayne Tower, Suite 3636
Miami, Florida 33131
Attorney for Cities of Belle Glade
and Clewiston
** 4
Katharine Stollman, Esquire
Allison Burdette
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher, & Flom
1440 New York Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005
Attorney for South Florida Water
Management District
Jackie Waters, Esquire
So. Florida Water Management District
Box 24680
3301 Gun Club Road
West Palm Beach, FL 33416
ALSO PRESENT: Toni Lafuente
Mike Rose
David Buker
** 5
THEREUPON,
SHARON TROST
being by me first duly sworn to tell the whole truth,
as hereinafter certified, testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. NASH:
Q. Ms. Trost, I'm Beverly Nash, counsel for
the United States in this litigation.
We're here to find out what the Water
Management District has in the way of computers,
and what the information is on that computer, how
it's stored, how it's formatted.
You're here today as a representative of
the Water Management District having knowledge
concerning one or more of several areas that we are
interested in finding out about.
Have you been shown the list of
categories?
A. Yes.
Q. And which category or categories are you
here to respond to?
A. I would need to see the list again. I
know a little bit in general about No. 1, No. 2,
** 6
No. 6, and No. 7.
Q. What is your present title or position?
A. I'm the director of the water supply
planning division.
Q. And what is your job description?
A. I'm responsible for the development of
four regional water supply plants that cover the
geographic area of the district.
In these plants, we're going to project
the future water demands for both agricultural,
urban and environmental use; and we will also
quantify the available supply through the use of
computer models that simulate surface water and
ground water availability.
After we make a comparison of the supply
and the demand, then, we would prepare a plan that
would describe what to do in areas where we did not
have adequate water.
Q. How long have you been in the roll of the
director of the water supply planning division?
A. Since October 1st of 1989.
Q. Have you been in any other positions at the
Water Management District?
A. Yes, I have.
Q. What positions are those?
** 7
A. I was the director of the Hydrogeology
Division from September of '85 till October of '89.
Q. Any others?
A. Yes. And prior to that, I held various
levels of the hydrogeologist, professional
hydrogeologist position from November of 1980 to
September of '85.
Q. And what were your job responsibilities as
director of the Hydrogeology Division?
A. I was responsible for developing and
overseeing broad based ground water resource
assessment studies, overseeing the district's well
drilling geophysical logging operations, and
aquifer testing operations, directing the
preparation of ground water simulation models, and
the writing of technical reports, preparation of
map series that described water availability.
Q. What's your educational background?
A. I have a Bachelor of Science in geological
science from Lehigh University in Bethlehem,
Pennsylvania. I attended graduate school at the
University of Arizona in Tucson, Arizona in the
hydrology and water resource administration
program.
Q. Who are your supervisors at the Water
** 8
Management District?
A. Jim Harvey and Dick Rogers.
Q. What is Mr. Harvey's title?
A. Deputy director of the planning
department.
Q. And Mr. Rogers?
A. Director of the planning department.
Q. Do you have employees who work for you in
the water supply planning division?
A. Yes, I do.
Q. And how many?
A. 17. No, I guess it would be 19 counting
temporaries.
Q. What is the nature of their positions?
A. I have a number of different disciplines
that report to me, including engineers,
hydrogeologist, supervising professionals,
programmer analyst, staff economist, staff water
use planners, staff water use engineer, GIS CADD
technician, administrative secretary, and temporary
planning technicians.
Q. What computers are utilized in the water
supply planning division?
A. We utilize personal computers, IMB
personal computers, which vary between ATs, PS2,
** 9
Model 70's, compacts. We use a SUN work station,
and a DEC work station, and we use the mainframe
computer?
Q. Is that the Cyber mainframe?
A. Yes.
Q. What work was done on the Cyber mainframe?
A. On the Cyber mainframe, we extract data
from the hydrologic data base, such as, rainfall
information or other information that would be
input into one of the ground water simulation
models.
Q. Any other uses of the Cyber?
A. Not that I'm aware. It's just a storing
house of data.
Q. And what use is made of the DEC work
station?
A. The DEC work station is used to run the
ground water simulation models.
Q. Is there more than one ground water
simulation model?
A. No. The one that we're using now is
called the Modflow Model. There are a lot of
different models, but we're not using anything
other than that one for our work purposes.
Q. And how long have you used the Modflow
** 10
Model?
MS. STOLLMAN: I object to that
question. I don't think it's relevant to this
deposition how long she's used a certain model.
MS. NASH: It's extremely relevant
if there are other models that were used during the
relevant time frame, Katharine; and that's what I'm
trying to find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: Okay. Well, you've
asked her if there are other models --
MS. NASH: Well, we can either spend
the time and go through every single model and she
can tell me when she used it or she can tell me
simply how long this one has been in use and that
may alleviate all the other questions on that, so
you can have it either way you want.
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer it to
the extent that you know of other models that were
used.
A. I don't know of any other models that were
used by my staff, and I believe that we've used the
Modflow since 1986; and I don't know when in 1986.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Okay. Is there other work
that's done on the DEC work station?
A. All the work that we're doing on the DEC
** 11
work station in my division is -- has to do with
running the models. Sometimes you have files set
up that have the input data for the models,
sometimes the station is used to process the model
to run the actual model.
Q. What work is done on the SUN work station?
A. The same as what's done on the DEC work
station.
Q. And what work is done on the IMB PC?
A. The IBM PC's are used for word processing,
routine correspondence, for developing the annual
operating budget of my division, and for any other
data manipulation that the staff would do before
they would get ready to actually run a model.
Q. What is the software that's used on the
Cyber?
A. The Cyber doesn't really use software.
It's a mainframe computer that -- it's a text
editor that's on the Cyber.
Q. Does that text editor have a name?
A. When I used it, it was called X Edit. I
do not know what it's called now.
Q. What is the software that's utilized on
the DEC?
A. I don't know the names of any specific
** 12
software on the DEC. There is one called -- there
is one called LINDO?
Q. What software is utilized on the SUN work
station?
A. Just the Modflow Model, which would also
be used on the DEC.
Q. And what software is utilized on the IBM
PC?
A. I don't know the names of all the software
utilized on the IBM PCs, but some items would be:
Symphony Spreadsheet, Harvard Graphics, Auto/CADD,
Word Perfect; and then, there is some communication
mechanisms to communicate with the other PCs in the
mainframe computer.
Q. Do you know what those communication
mechanisms are?
A. I don't know exactly what they're called,
but I just know that they enable us to allow
different machines to talk to each other.
Q. Has your division done any water supply
studies on the computer relating directly to the
Everglades Agricultural Area?
A. My division has not.
Q. Do you know whether any such studies have
been done relating to the Everglades Agricultural
** 13
Area or other divisions?
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer to the
extent that you know.
A. The Water Resources Division has performed
some modelling work that I coordinated, but that's
another division down the hall from my division.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Do you know whether your
division has done any modelling work on the Water
Conservation Areas?
A. My division has not.
Q. Do you know whether other divisions in the
Water Management District have?
A. Yes, the Water Resources Division.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
on the Everglades National Park?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether other divisions have?
A. I don't know.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
on the Holeyland tract?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether other divisions have?
A. I think the Water Resources Division may
have.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
** 14
on the Rotenberger tract?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether other divisions have?
A. I think the Water Resources Division may
have.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
from the Everglades SWIM plan?
A. My division has not, however, I
coordinated an assignment for that with the Water
Resources Division.
Q. What was the source of the information
that went into the water modelling for the SWIM
plan?
MS. STOLLMAN: Are you referring to
"the source of the information," what computer
system that came from?
MS. NASH: No.
A. I'm not sure I understand the question.
Could you rephrase it?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Yes. The information that
was utilized to do the water modelling for the
Everglades SWIM plan, where did it come from?
A. I don't know exactly where it came from.
Q. Who would know?
A. Someone in the Water Resources Division.
** 15
Q. What was your job in coordinating the
modelling for the SWIM plan?
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer to the
extent that it related to your work for the
computers?
A. I was not specifically working with the
computers for that assignment.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Do you know who was?
A. Ray Santee and Paul Trimble.
Q. Do you know what data bases they utilized
to do the water modelling?
A. No, I don't.
Q. Did you do any water use modelling before
the Lake Okeechobee Technical Advisory Committee?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, this is limited
to water modelling done on the computer system.
A. No, I didn't do any modelling for the
LOTAC Committee.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Do you know whether any
water modelling was done for LOTAC?
A. I don't know. I'm not sure.
Q. Do you know who might know?
A. Paul Whalen or Tony Federico.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
for the proposed water management areas?
** 16
A. That was the assignment that I coordinated
with the Water Resources Division.
Q. But you don't know what data bases were
used for that?
A. No.
Q. Did your division do any water modelling
for the nutrient removal project?
A. No.
Q. Has your division done any water modelling
for agricultural area Best Management Practices?
A. No.
Q. You testified that you're responsible for
developing four water supply plants, what are the
areas encompassed by those plants?
A. The entire area of the district is
encompassed by the plants. The district is broken
into four geographic areas.
Q. What are the four geographic areas?
A. The upper east coast, the Kissimmee
basin, the lower west coast and the lower east
coast.
Q. What is the present status of the plants
for the lower west coast?
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, this would be
limited to plants which are on the computer.
** 17
Anything that you work on with respect to the
computer system, not your other responsibilities.
A. There is a model developed for the lower
west coast that we're going to use to prepare the
water supply plant for Lee County. The model is
for Lee County. We still have a long way to go
until that plant is ready.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) What is the status on the
plant for the lower east coast?
MS. STOLLMAN: I would object to any
questions about plants that are in development for
which there is data involved in the system.
MS. NASH: But she can answer the
question.
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you repeat the
question, please?
MS. NASH: Let's read back the
question.
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: Could you clarify the
question, please?
MS. NASH: It's the same question I
** 18
asked about the lower west coast that she was
capable of answering, so I'm sure she understands
the question.
A. At this point in time, we only have a
framework laid out for the task that must be
accomplished to write the plan. We have not
initiated any of the modelling for the plant.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) You mentioned that when you
were director of the Hydrogeological Division --
A. Hydrogeology Division.
Q. -- Hydrogeology Division, you prepared
ground water simulation models?
A. They were prepared under my direction,
yes.
Q. Can you describe those models?
A. The first one to be completed under my
direction was the Palm Beach County
Three-dimensional Ground Water Assessment Model.
The second one to be completed was the
Hendry County Three-dimensional Water Assessment
Model.
The third one was the Lee County Ground
Water Assessment Model. Possibly the Lee County
was done a few months before the Hendry, but
they're within a few months of each other. I'm not
** 19
sure of the order.
Q. Was actual data utilized in the Palm Beach
County Assessment Model?
A. What do you mean by "actual data"?
Q. Real data. Was real data utilized in the
Palm Beach County?
A. Yes.
Q. What was the source of that data?
A. Water level measurements, rainfall data,
evapo transpiration data, aquifer perimeter data.
Q. And from where was the water level
measurement data obtained from?
A. The U.S. Geological Survey and from our
own network.
Q. In what format was the data from USGS?
MS. STOLLMAN: This is the computer
format.
A. Yeah, but I don't know. I don't know.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) In what format was the data
from your own network?
A. I don't know.
Q. Who would know the format of the data from
USGS?
A. I'm not sure. I think I know.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, I don't want you
** 20
to speculate if you don't know.
A. Okay. I'm not sure.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Who would know the format
of the Water Management District's data?
A. What data?
Q. You said it was data from -- you also
utilized data from your own network?
A. Maryjo Shine, S-h-i-n-e.
Q. What was the source of the rainfall data
that you utilized?
A. The district's hydrologic data base.
Q. And where is that data base located?
A. On the mainframe computer.
Q. And where is the evapo transpiration data
from?
A. It's also on the hydrologic data base, and
through published reports.
Q. The reports published by whom?
A. I'm not sure, but probably a combination
of the Water Management District and the U.S.
Geological Survey.
Q. I believe you also mentioned absorption
data?
A. No, I did not mention absorption data.
Q. You mentioned aquifer perimeter data?
** 21
A. Yes.
Q. Where was that data from?
A. We collected that data in the field.
Q. Your division collected that data?
A. Yes.
Q. In what manner was that data collected?
MS. STOLLMAN: I object to that
question. I don't think the manner for the
collection of data is relevant.
MS. NASH: You can answer the
question.
MS. STOLLMAN: You can answer to the
extent that you know.
A. First, the hydrogeologist figures out
where they need information to develop the model,
then, they decide where --
MS. STOLLMAN: Let me interrupt you
for a minute. I think that your answer is going to
go well beyond the scope of this deposition, and I
instruct the witness not to answer.
MS. NASH: We're entitled to know
where the data came from.
MS. STOLLMAN: And you know where it
came from. They collected it at the district.
You're not entitled to know how they set out to
** 22
collect it and the perimeters they used.
MS. NASH: To the extent that it
leads to the computerization of data, we are most
certainly entitled to know that.
MS. STOLLMAN: But her answer clearly
was going beyond the computerization of data, and I
don't think it's relevant to this deposition.
MS. NASH: Let her finish the answer
and we'll find out.
MS. STOLLMAN: I'm not going to have
you go on a fishing expedition. She began her
answer. It was clearly well beyond anything having
to do with the computers.
MS. NASH: You don't know that,
because they may have used computers out in the
field. If you'd let her finish the answer, she can
answer that question.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, if you'd like to
ask her if they used computers out in the field,
you may do so.
MS. NASH: Let her finish her answer.
MS. STOLLMAN: She may not answer the
question that you asked. If you would like to ask
her, if they used computers out in the field, you
may do so.
** 23
Q. (By Ms. Nash) The question is: What is
the source of the aquifer perimeter data that was
utilized in the Palm Beach County Ground Water
Assessment Data?
MS. STOLLMAN: And to the extent that
the sources are computer sources, she may answer
the question.
MS. NASH: We're also entitled to
know where the data came from that got into the
computer.
MS. STOLLMAN: You've asked that
question and it has been answered.
MS. NASH: She has not answered the
question.
MS. STOLLMAN: The district collected
it. That's an answer.
MS. NASH: Fine. And they need to
know where it collected it and when it collected
the data, so that we know what data we're accepting
from.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, if you'd like to
ask questions along that line to know when the data
is from that are in the files, those are different
questions from the ones that you have asked.
MS. NASH: That's correct. And I
** 24
will get to them after I find out where the data is
from.
THE WITNESS: I fail to see what any
of this has to do with -- this is all ground water
information of an aquifer.
MS. STOLLMAN: You don't need to
testify when there is no question pending.
THE WITNESS: Sorry.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) The question is: Where is
the aquifer perimeter dated from?
MS. STOLLMAN: I believe that's been
asked and answered.
MS. NASH: No, it has not. I will ask
again.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where is the aquifer
perimeter data collected from?
MS. STOLLMAN: That's been asked and
answered.
MS. NASH: It has not been answered.
MS. STOLLMAN: Perhaps we could go
back into the transcript, the last question before
the one that is currently pending.
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter as follows:)
** 25
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where was that data from?
A. We collected that data in the field.
Q. Your division collected that data?
A. Yes.
(WHEREUPON, the deposition continued
as follows:)
Q. (By Ms. Nash) Where in the field was that
the data collected?
A. At several sites in Palm Beach County. I
don't know the exact locales.
Q. Is there a record of where those sites
are?
A. Yes.
Q. Where is that record?
A. In the technical publication which
describes the study.
Q. What is the name of the technical
publication?
A. Ground Water Resource Assessment of
Eastern Palm Beach County, Florida.
Q. What is the date that that was published?
A. I don't know. I believe 1988.
** 26
Q. Has your division done any work on the
regulation schedules?
A. What regulation schedules?
Q. Regulation schedules in the Water
Conservation Areas?
A. No. My division has not.
Q. Has your division done any work in the
Water Conservation Areas on drought impact?
A. No, we have not.
Q. You indicated one of your employees is a
GIS CADD technician?
A. Yes.
Q. What is the nature of the work that this
employee does in GIS?
A. She doesn't yet do any work in GIS. She
does work in CADD.
Q. What's the nature of the work she does in
CADD?
A. She makes maps for our publications and
for presentations.
Q. For what projects has she made maps?
A. For every project since she's worked in
our division, and I wouldn't recall exactly which
ones.
Q. What's the name of this technician that's
** 27
doing your CADD work?
A. Cynthia Whalen.
Q. You indicated when you were with the
Hydrogeology Division, you wrote technical reports
on water availability.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Do those reports have specific names?
MS. STOLLMAN: Are these reports --
A. Which reports are you referring to?
Q. (By Ms. Nash) I'm trying to find out what
ones you wrote while you were --
A. Ones that I wrote or that my staff wrote?
Q. That your staff wrote.
MS. STOLLMAN: You may answer to the
extent that these are reports that you wrote using
the computer.
A. The three major ones are the ones I have
mentioned already. The Palm Beach County Perimeter
Resource Assessment Report; the Lee County
Three-dimensional Ground Water Flow Model Report;
and the Hendry County Ground Water Resource
Assessment Report.
Q. (By Ms. Nash) When was the Lee County
report done?
A. The Lee County report was done in 1989.
** 28
Q. And the Hendry County report?
A. In 1989, I think.
Q. Is the work you do on the DEC backed up in
any fashion?
A. I don't know how they do that.
Q. Who would know?
A. The programer analyst.
Q. And who was that?
A. Pattie Everett.
Q. Is the work done on the SUN work station
backed up?
A. I don't know. If it is, it would be the
same answer as for the DEC.
MS. NASH: I have no further
questions.
MS. STOLLMAN: Do you want to take a
break before we continue?
THE WITNESS: Yeah. I'd like to have
a glass of water.
(Short break.)
** 29
CROSS-EXAMINATION
QUESTIONS BY MR. RICHARDS:
Q. Ms. Trost, my name is Joe Richards. I
represent the cities of Belle Glade and Clewiston.
You mentioned you were aware of a
modelling for the EAA by the Water Resources
Division. Do you know what individual would be
responsible for that project?
A. As I mentioned before, it would probably
be Mr. Trimble or Mr. Santee.
Q. And that would be the same for the one you
mentioned regarding the Water Conservation Areas?
A. Yes, because it's all one model.
Q. Any other areas that pertain to that model
besides EAA and the water conservation area?
A. I'm not sure of the full geographic extent
of that model.
Q. Are you aware of any water supply study or
modelling for the City of Belle Glade?
A. No, I'm not.
Q. How about the City of Clewiston?
A. No, I'm not.
Q. This water supply study that may be being
performed by Mr. Santee and Mr. Trimble, do you
** 30
know to what extent that is being performed, what
it entails?
A. I don't understand the question.
Q. The water supply modelling for the EAA in
the conservation areas, could you explain that?
MS. STOLLMAN: She's testified that
she doesn't work on it. You can answer to the
extent that you know.
MR. RICHARDS: Well, she said she
coordinated it so --
A. The analysis was to determine the
potential --
MS. STOLLMAN: Again, I think the
answer to this question is going to go beyond the
scope of this deposition.
MR. RICHARDS: I'm sure that this
work is being performed on a computer, if that's
your concerned.
MS. STOLLMAN: Whether it's being
performed on a computer or not is not my sole
concern.
You have identified a water model. You
have identified where it exists, and who works on
it. This witness does not work on it, and she's
not here to testify in detail about how the models
** 31
are set up. She's here to testify about water
models --
MR. RICHARDS: I think it's perfectly
reasonable that I --
MS. STOLLMAN: -- and where they are
located on the system.
MR. RICHARDS: -- inquire into the
general nature of this model that she identified.
MS. STOLLMAN: You have already done
so.
MR. RICHARDS: She just indicated the
location.
MS. STOLLMAN: And what type of water
model it is.
MR. RICHARDS: I don't think she got
to identify the type.
MS. STOLLMAN: What was your
question?
MR. RICHARDS: Could you read back
the question?
(WHEREUPON, the requested testimony
was read back by the court reporter.)
MS. STOLLMAN: I think your question
** 32
goes well beyond the scope of this deposition.
To the extent that you need more
information to identify where the models are
located, you may ask questions. To the extent that
you want to know how the models operate, that is
inappropriate at this time.
MS. NASH: It is not
inappropriate, Katharine, because No. 7 clearly
says: "The locations (where prepared and where
maintained) of all water use modelling performed
and the techniques used," and that is what Mr.
Richards is trying to inquire into.
MR. RICHARDS: I think you're
unreasonably limiting the inquiry here. I mean,
she identified a model, but we don't know what type
of model it is other than water supply; and it's
perfectly reasonable for us to inquire a little
deeper into this area.
MS. STOLLMAN: I think it's
reasonable to inquire to the extent that you need
to know where these models are located and what's
--
MR. RICHARDS: Well, we need to know
what type of model it is, what it entails, what the
goals are, so I can know whether we need it or
** 33
not. That's the whole purpose of this deposition
is to find what data you have and where it's
located.
MS. STOLLMAN: I understand that.
MR. RICHARDS: So I need to be able
to ask these questions to make those
determinations.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, as an initial
matter, this witness has testified that she did not
specifically design the model. She helped
coordinate it. I don't want her to speculate on
things that she does not know.
And No. 2, I think as a general matter,
you may inquire as to what exists on this model,
but not as a specific -- not to the level of detail
that you have been inquiring.
MR. RICHARDS: I'm just seeking
general information. She identified a model, a
water supply model, and that's all she said. I
just want to ask a few more questions about the
type of model and what's entailed.
MS. STOLLMAN: But I don't believe
that what is entailed in the model is an
appropriate question. If you want to get
information that will assist you in knowing what is
** 34
contained on the model as opposed to another model
so that you can know which you would like to
obtain, that is a general question which I would
permit the witness to answer. I will not permit
her to answer questions which go into the detail of
every element of the model, how it was designed,
and how it was set up.
MR. RICHARDS: The techniques were
specifically asked for in the subpoena.
MS. STOLLMAN: The question reads:
"The locations (where prepared and where
maintained) of all water use modelling performed
and the techniques used, for the Everglades SWIM
plan, LOTAC I, LOTAC II, proposed WMAs, the ENR
Project, EAA BMPS, the Water Conservation Areas
and Everglades National Park."
I think it's our interpretation that the
techniques used are the computer techniques which
were used to design the models and where those
models are located on which computers. It's not
the techniques used in terms of what the model is
going to tell you and why they were set up in that
way.
MR. RICHARDS: So are you instructing
her not to answer my question?
** 35
MS. STOLLMAN: She can answer your
question to the extent it's limited to general
information required to enable you to locate the
models and to know how one model may differ from
another so that you can determine if you are
interested in obtaining that model.
Q. (By Mr. Richards) Ms. Trost, do you know
what models were used for this study you
identified?
MS. STOLLMAN: What study are you
referring to?
MR. RICHARDS: The EAA WCA water
model that you've identified.
A. I believe the South Florida Water
Management Model was the model used.
Q. (By Mr. Richards) Do you know who
developed the model?
A. No, I do not.
Q. Do you know who would know?
A. I think, Mr. Trimble or Mr. Santee would
know.
Q. You stated that your division hadn't
performed any modelling for the EAA BMPs, do you
know what division would be doing that work?
A. No, I am unaware of any model of that
** 36
nature.
Q. Are you aware of any model for the
Everglades Nutrient Removal Project?
A. No, I'm not.
Q. Of the four regions you mentioned, which
of those regions would include or encompass the
EAA?
A. The lower east coast region.
Q. And that would be the same for the Water
Conservation Areas and Everglades National Park?
A. Yes.
Q. The ground water simulation model for
Hendry County, has that been published?
A. No, it has not yet been published.
Q. When do you expect it to be published?
MS. STOLLMAN: I object to that
question. I don't think the date of publication is
relevant.
You may answer the question.
A. Probably within the next 90 days.
Q. (By Mr. Richards) Do you know if the
entire county is included in that report?
A. Yes, it is.
Q. And the Palm Beach County study that you
mentioned, that was only for the eastern part of
** 37
the county?
A. Yes, it was.
Q. Do you know the approximate location of
the western extent of that study?
A. South of C-51 -- the western boundary is
the outside of the conservation areas. North of
the C-51, it extends up through the Calusa
properties.
Q. Ms. Nash asked you about the WCA
regulation schedules and you said that you weren't
aware -- that your division wasn't doing work on
that. Do you know what division would be
responsible for that work?
A. Of what work?
Q. Work with the regulation schedules for the
Water Conservation Areas.
MS. STOLLMAN: That's assuming a fact
not in evidence. You haven't asked her whether
there are any.
A. I'm not aware that there are any.
Q. (By Mr. Richards) Are you aware of any
drought impact studies for the Water Conservation
Areas?
A. No.
Q. Everglades National Park?
** 38
A. No.
Q. EAA?
A. No.
Q. What about the urban areas of the east
coast?
A. What about them?
Q. Are you aware of any drought impact
studies and water supplies for the urban areas in
the east coast?
A. No.
Q. Do you know what division would be
responsible for drought impact work, if it was
done?
A. The Water Resources Division.
MR. RICHARDS: I don't have any
further questions.
I want the record to reflect that I
believe that Ms. Stallman has unreasonably limited
the area of questioning with this witness as to
work that she has coordinated and has prevented us
from knowing what water modelling has been done for
the specific areas, questions that will prevent us
from properly identifying work that we would
request, and may lead to the further need for
deposition.
** 39
MS. STOLLMAN: I would just like to
state that Mr. Richards is welcome to ask this
witness which models are used for which projects,
but I'm not permitting the witness to answer about
specific elements of the models and how they were
set up.
MR. RICHARDS: I believe we have
questioned other witnesses into the nature of
their work, and their purposes, and goals; and that
at this late juncture in this deposition, I believe
you are unreasonably restricting inquiry.
MS. STOLLMAN: Well, it's my view
that the previous questions were designed to elicit
information that was required to identify what
different data bases and files were used for so
that you could know which ones you were interested
in obtaining.
The questions here today with respect to
these water models go well beyond that. Questions
similar to the ones asked in the past, would be
appropriate.
MR. RICHARDS: I think the line of
questioning has been similar throughout this
deposition. That's all.
I have no further questions for this
** 40
witness.
(The deposition was concluded at 1:00
o'clock p.m.)
